Detaching & Attaching Blocks. Scrapyard Survival.

4Peace shared this feedback 42 days ago
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Hello, my fellow scrapyard engineers đź‘‹


Right now, there’s no easy way to detach a block or a section of a grid without destroying everything it’s connected to. We’ve all been there: salvaging Factorum or other encounters, wanting to recover valuable blocks intact, or trying to move our own blocks without grinding them down. Think about big block like fabricators, refineries, or jump drives.

Or think about playing a scrapyard scenario, or any playstyle that doesn’t rely on the traditional mining-production loop, or only uses it partially. In all these cases, the lack of a clean way to detach and reattach blocks makes the process more tedious and less immersive.


This gets even more interesting if grinding could optionally produce scrap instead of components. That could be a difficulty setting or even useful option for backpack building. For example, you grind down a catwalk into iron scrap, then use that scrap to backpack-build any other iron-based block.

In that context, being able to detach and reattach blocks becomes even more valuable as you do not want to craft all the components again from the scrap or even lose some part of materials during grinding.



How would detaching work?


With a grinder, of course 🙂

Just like the hand drill has a secondary terrain-clear mode, the grinder could have a secondary detach mode.

  • Aim at a block with a grinder.
  • The connected surfaces in the direction you’re looking at highlight.
  • Hold RMB to “grind” those connections.
  • After a short time, the highlight changes color, showing the connection is gone.

If nothing else is holding the block, it detaches immediately. If it’s still connected somewhere else, you just repeat the process on the remaining sides or nearby blocks until the whole section comes free. This feels both realistic and intuitive, plus showing you connection points is useful on its own.


Example:

You have a refinery sitting on the floor. Instead of tearing up half the base underneath it, you simply stand next to it and look slightly down. The bottom attachment highlights. Use the grinder to grind the connection until the highlight turns red. Still attached? Look at that side and notice a couple of catwalks and it show you the connection with yellow highlight. Grind those connections as well. Done. The refinery is now a separate grid, free to move wherever you want.


Figure 1. Highlighting attachemnt on the bottom of the block

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Figure 2. No more attachment on the bottom, weady to detach other blocks on the side.

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And attaching it back?

Also simple, and no merge block required.

  • Take out a welder.
  • Aim the detached block (or grid) near another grid.
  • Nearby attachable surfaces highlight so you can clearly see where it will connect.
  • Hold RMB to weld it in place.

Welding could take a bit longer depending on the surface area.


Figure 3. Refinery positioned near armor blocks at the bottom and on the side showing where it will attach.

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Why this would be awesome?

I think you already know, but here are some of the most noticeable possibilities, this system opens up:

  • Less rigid base planning
    The refinery example is just one of many use cases. You no longer need to carefully plan everything far in advance or build those strange, never-really-finished semi-permanent bases with intentionally reserved empty space “just in case.” and live with all this ugliness for a while. Instead, your base can naturally grow and evolve over time. If you need more room or decide to change something, you simply move blocks or whole sections to a new place.
  • Modular bases and outposts
    On your main base, you could keep a relatively small setup to print modules or sections. These can then be used on site or transported and attached to other outposts or secondary bases, instead of welding everything on site, which is often inconvenient in gravity.
  • Missions and Campaign
    There can be various interesting campaing missions or contracts that ask you to do certain tasks like "detach this thing and attach elsewhere", "deliver this weather station module to the platform at GPS coords and attach it there", "finish the she ship and separate it from the base (it might be connected by a cockpit so it feels natural to avoid grinding it down lol)" and so on.
  • Easier ship construction
    You could build sections of larger ships separately and then connect them together, without relying on massive and cumbersome printers or worrying about always having space for temporary merge blocks. Once mechanical blocks are in the game, building cranes to assist with building larger would also become an interesting option eben on planets.
  • Next-level space shipyards
    Space-based shipyards would benefit hugely. You could still use large welder walls or printers, but you would also have the option to use much smaller printer setups to rapidly build smaller grid sections and then assemble them using tug ships. Use those salvaged jump drives or whatever to easily incorporate in your builds. bring your existing ships back to the shipyard to upgrade/modify them. Becasue let's be honest, without possibility for easy detachment and attachment of grid parts, you would rather throw it away and build a new one.
  • Interact with NPC and Economy
    You can also buy one of those ships on NPC station for the base hull, update it, use it for some kind of activity to gather more materials or money, and then repeat the upgrade cycle.
  • More engaging and PCU-friendly building
    This opens up entirely new dimensions for survival engineering and ship/base design. It supports a more modular or section-based approach to building. And having smaller printers is just more performance friendly, require less materials to build and less restrictive when things like max welders number is set on the server. Your shipyard can look more like a shipyard where you make ships and not like a giant windmill. 🙂
  • A huge boost for scrapyard and scavenger playstyles
    Last but not least, and somewhat obvious, scrapyard-focused gameplay—or many others, such as pirating or doing contracts and scavenging. I want to have many equally viable options to progress in survival, besides mining/production loop.

And this really matters for vanilla gameplay. Mods can only go so far. A system like this needs to be deeply integrated into the core game to feel polished, balanced, and truly enjoyable for old and new players.



I genuinely believe this could be one of those features that makes SE2 stand out for years to come or even make Space Engineers 2 immortal. 🚀


And I’d really love to hear what you guys would do with a system like this. I’m sure there are tons of ideas already forming in your heads, I hope this can feed your "need to create". 🙂

Replies (9)

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After playin SE1 for years I kinda burned out, not gonna lie. Did the usual survival, mined stupid amount of ore, big bases, big ships same loop again and agin. Then one day I randomly stumbled on Splitsie’s scrapyard survival videos… and damn. That completely pulled me back in i tried it myself and it honestly made me love survival again. Like actually thinking, improvising, making weird stuff work with whatever junk you find. If anyone reading this hasn’t seen those videos, seriously, go watch them. They’re fun as hell and also show what SE survival could be.

Being able to detach and attach blocks just takes the sandbox to another level. Scrapyard kinda thing is just one example. I’m using block detach mod and welding patch mod in literally every survival playthrough now. I can’t go back the game just feels so limited once you’ve tasted that freedom.

And that’s with mods. Kinda janky sometimes… I can only imagine how insanely good it would be if this was done propely in vanilla, by the devs, fully integrated and polished.


Keen pls. Seriously. This alone makes me want to go back and play SE1 after 10+ years. If this was in SE2, I’d buy everything you sell, no joke, and I’d probably convince a bunch of friends to jump back in too.

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so attaching and detaching blocks? i saw this in a battery mod and it was good. rather than grinding and rebuilding, it's essentially a move block from location A to location B. without having to fill up your inventory. i think this specifically would be a good idea.

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This would be one way of making rare blocks work. Find rare block, detach it, reattach it to your own ship.

Alternative is grind block without breaking it into components (have the whole block in inventory), and then rebuild it as a whole block. This would carry its rare properties to a new location.

TBH I would have both - detach/attach, and move blocks in inventory without disassembly.

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You want to be able to grind to scrap AND to components? And detaching. This is 3, and we have only 2 mouse buttons :)


A Tier 4 grinder might be grinding into components.


Or even better, instead of boring tier 1–4 grinders, there could be just one basic grinder and 2 advanced ones. First is faster grinding to scrap, the other — grinding to components.


Big grinder blocks could always grind to scrap, as you often prefer to recycle to base materials on a large scale to reutilize them more effectively, rather than forming big stockpiles of components you might not need.

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Or make a option for grinder blocks, so you can tick a box if they should scrap or not.

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Hmm...

Looks like we need a 4th tool, for when you want to grind down a block quickly, yet without recovering any scrap or components?

Something like a 'planned rapid disassembly' tool?


Where you take the old-style welder, attach a gas line to the bottom and unscrew the top part, putting on a small shield emitter instead that makes a meter-long thin tube off the top for the cutting-flame inside, fed from hydrogen from your backpack...


which hums...


and glows...


...and will slice through blocks like a...well, like a glowing-hot knife through butter.


The P.R.I.D.A.T, ladies and gentlemen, for your pleasure :)

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The issue this solves, is if you grind a refinery down for example, you need 3-4 trips of emptying and refilling your inventory to place the refinery again, since the components it's made of are so heavy and so plentiful.


A weld away an attachment point, allows you to

- Detach the refinery = still welding time, but less.

- Detaching the refinery = no inventory management.

- Moving the refiner to new attachment spot = gravity gun is one conceptual way to do this.

- Placement could be as easy as holding ctrl and wasd etc. (same way we place blocks already).


Also this might save you painting time, since people paint some blocks, and change their paint pallet after. So moving a block means less time spent setting paint colour potentially compared to rebuilding the block.


The issue with block in inventory is that it could be argued it's miniaturization tech, (which is more crazy than a gravity gun) and people could take a refinery and be overweight, but then hop in a vehicle and speed away after. which means the over-encumbered part disappears unless a mechanic is added into the game where over-encumbered people can't access vehicles.


Gravity gun is probably an easier implementation to add to move bigger objects. For smaller objects the space engineer could physically carry them.

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You can still move heavy blocks or big sections of grids by using other ships, rovers or some sort of mechanincal arms or cranes. Gravity gun is something I have never considered before. You can make a separate topic and we can explore this possibility there.

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Similar problems can be solved by "tiny" agile ships with an abundance of engines and gyroscopes – something like space harbor tugs or handling trucks. Various small cars or even "walking robots" (advanced girls' engineering school!) can be used on the planet.

This is what my little workhorse looks like. It can handle loads of over 400 tons (it weighs just over 20 tons itself and can carry up to 60 tons of material in its on-board storage).

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https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3310108974

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A gravity gun is an appealingly simple solution, but physically quite nonsensical. Unfortunately...

I would prefer to see winches, ropes, and anchors in the game... It's a less attractive and certainly less practical solution... but physically more correct and realistic.

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Hey, I did a suggestion for the inventory side of things:

Block Slot for character inventory

Basically allow carrying a SINGLE block in character inventory. Detach -> Block Slot -> Attach.

That would be in addition to detach/attach where you manipulate the block in game world without it going to your inventory.

Some overlap I guess, if they implement this, the Block Slot would be somewhat redundant. Depends on what kind of gameplay is desired.

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Yeah, this is a more general approach. For big and heavy blocks like JD or refineries, I hardly believe they can be carried as a whole in your backpack :) After you have detached a block or a portion of the grid, you could be able to move lightweight blocks with your hand on planets and even bigger weight in space up to some limit, this could be yet another separate suggestion. Or you can deploy small scale drones. Small-scale drones can be used for many things actually, like, for instance, placing projections, so you can avoid flying around everywhere with your jetpack, which is kinda OP on planets probably because there is no other good way of doing that.

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How would you snap the block to the grid again? It needs to be lined up perfectly for it to work. This is what the merge block does - aligns the block perfectly.

Sure a gravity gun could do it but it would likely cause some awkward movement when the block snaps into place. ... But so does the merge block so yeah, maybe it's okay. I'll give my vote

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Presumably it would use same logic as when building, except instead of a hologram, you get a built block that appears to teleport from wherever it is, to where youre "attaching" it. On a condition of "proximity", like drag the block within a few meters of where you want it.

I dont think having to exactly position it to the 25cm grid resolution and then weld in-place would be fun. 25cm off and it welds to the wrong location!

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Scrapyard has a weld plate that you would build on the object and where you want it to go. Once they are aligned they weld together.

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This sounds a lot like the Advanced Engineering mod for SE1. I know that one, I like the concept and I'm in favor of bringing it to SE2. I'd also suggest taking the concept of weld pads from the Advanced Engineering mod. With those the point where it welds is well defined and not subject to randomly slipping by 25 cm.

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Welding pads are OK, but I think they should not require any materials for better convenience. On the other hand, I'd like for bigger surfaces to require more time to weld together rather than instantly snapping 2 giant grids together like we did with the merge block, to make it feel more significant and interactive.

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A similar topic has already been discussed here. As I have already written, I am all for the possibility of recycling and reusing blocks and entire assemblies.

Not only for the possibility of reusing rare finished blocks, but also for the possibility of repairing and modifying heavily damaged ships and wrecks. I have been playing with the Advanced Welding https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=510790477 and Improvised Engineering / Improvised Experimentation plugins https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2890866161 https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2891367014 for the last few years and I can't imagine playing without them.

Advanced welding solves most of the problems raised by the previous discussant. I highly recommend trying it out. It's simply ingenious.

A pair of special "magnetic" elements are installed on the surfaces to be joined, and after the blocks are joined, they are removed from the game (i.e., welding is not entirely "free," but it is relatively inexpensive). The plugin informs you of the correct final position—the parallelism of the surfaces and the distance—but the message only appears when you are less than about one meter away.

The new plugin DB Physgun https://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/?id=3640936448 also looks interesting - I haven't tried it yet, but according to the video, it's a very powerful tool...

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I tried it... its simple gravitygun... :(

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Why don't I like gravity guns?

Because they don't respect the basic laws of physics—the law of action and reaction.

Simply put, a character weighing 200–2000 kg (with a hat, boots, and backpack) cannot be the center of rotation or the fulcrum when manipulating an object weighing 20 or 200 tons...

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I like the concept here and gives me vibes of Digi's mods. Things being ground into scrap when we use our grinders is already a world setting in SE1. That's easy enough to port over for folks that want it. I also like the idea of something similar to Digi's mod becoming official. The ability to detach a block like say a small battery when trying to salvage stuff and being able to re-weld it to something else saves alot of time and effort without having to recraft capacitors/cells each time. Would definitely save a TON of time and make it less of a PITA to swap blocks like batteries around.

-Detaching: Seems simple enough, point and click basically to saw it loose, grab it with something then zoom out. There would need to be a brief delay to this so people can't just walk up and cut a block loose in half a second and be done. Since you used a refinery as an example I'll use it. Let's assume you can saw a face loose all at once just to keep it simple. I would put the time at around 7-10 seconds at least. This gives enough time that it can be a protection against an "oops that's the wrong block I'm trying to cut loose" moment. and if the refinery is attached by 3 different sides at least (bottom, then 2 pipes) it gives some time for potential defenders to try and stop it assuming there are any.

If something happens that all the connections aren't broken then one of several things can happen. Assuming you broke 2 out of the 3 connections for our refinery, if the 3rd isn't broken within a specific time limit then the other 2 connections can reset automatically. Or there can be some kind of indication on a block that some of its connections are broken and someone needs to hit really fast with the welder. I would imagine restoring broken connections to be free since you're not actually breaking anything down, and the 3rd connection was left intact. In other words it needs to be simple enough that folks can do it without having to beat their heads against a wall, but not so easy or quick that trolls can just roll in sawing up a base and bailing in less than 10 seconds. Or we don't have folks sawing their own stuff loose just because of a 1 frame misclick.


-Attaching/welding: again simple enough. You align it to the proper spot, weld it and you're good to go. The big question I would have for your system here is this, how can you guarantee you're always going to be in the exact right spot you need? Since we can use super tiny blocks now in SE2, we'll need a way to prevent moments where the blocks you're trying to fuse aren't misaligned by a single micron and that messing up the whole thing. Digi's mod solves this by aligning the weld pads. If you were at the helm would you use a similar approach or how do you envision it?


Overall I like the idea, but do have a few concerns that would need to be addressed.

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In Digi's mode for SE1, it's quite simple – and quite practical. The cutting/disconnection timer is derived from the block parameters (block assembly/disassembly time) and is reset if the disconnection process is interrupted. It's not so ideal...


I believe that the time required to disconnect a block from the grid should not depend on the number of surrounding blocks connected to the block being disconnected (or the number of connections), but only on the block that being disconnected.


Another option could be based on the block damage parameters known in SE1 – when a block is disassembled/damaged, two levels are highlighted:

1) loss of block functionality and

2) loss of control/ownership of the block.

In the case of disconnecting a block from the grid, there could be two similar parameters (perhaps even with the same values):

1) loss of block functionality (=> disconnection of control, power supply, and conveyors) and

2) physical disconnection of the block from the grid.

Repairing the disconnection of the block (before physically disconnecting the block from the grid) could be done in the same way as repairing damage, but without consuming additional material.


The issue of block ownership is also not insignificant. I believe that an "individual block" or "separate block" without a connection to the grid should automatically lose ownership - reset to "no one."


Connection/welding: In Digi's mode for SE1, new block connections are provided by "welding plates," which take some time to build and require some material. The connection of the blocks itself is immediate after bringing the pair of "welding plates" close together. The plates are pulled together and connected...

I believe that this behavior is necessary - players in Space Engineers usually work alone, and without mechanics to anchor the block in place, it is not possible to keep the blocks in place for the time necessary for subsequent welding to connect the blocks.

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Detaching


There can be several approaches on how to detach blocks and where to store temporary information about detaching progress.

We can use a special mode for the welder tool, or there can be a dedicated saw / cutting tool, which would greatly reduce the possibility of accidental cuts. What I originally proposed was the ability to loosen each side of a block depending on the direction you are looking. Now that I’m thinking about it again, a dedicated tool would probably be the better solution.

There could be a clear visual cue of what you are about to cut before you even start. Just by holding the tool and looking at the block, one of its attachment faces would highlight to show which surface will be cut. The surface area would determine how much time is required to cut it. After a face is fully cut, that surface changes color, indicating that this side is now loose. You then proceed to the next face or block until you fully detach the block or even an entire section of the grid.

Now, where to store temporary information about what is loose?

I can see two possible solutions here.

The first option is storing the progress in the tool itself. This means that as soon as you put the tool away, all detaching progress is reset.

The second option—more interesting in my opinion, though up to the developers to decide whether it’s feasible or desirable—is storing the progress in the block itself. Once you cut a face of a block, that side remains disconnected. There is no automatic reset. This could open up some very interesting mechanics: sliding structures with minimal clearance, intentional weak points, or even blocks that remain airtight despite no longer being mechanically connected.




Attaching

I don’t think welding pads are the best solution here.

First, you would need to place pads on two surfaces, which is not always easy. Second, the welding area might be much larger than a welding pad—for example, when attaching a whole section of a grid. I’d also prefer the process to feel more immersive and to depend on the actual surface area being attached.

Ideally, there would be a dedicated attachment / welding tool (actually, this is a real welder, while other tool is more like a "block creator"). When you look at a loose block and there is another grid nearby, you would see a visual cue highlighting the surface of the future attachment. This lets you confirm whether the alignment is correct before committing.

You then weld the first surface, and the block snaps into place. At that point, you can once again verify whether the alignment is correct or stop before you finish the welding. The time required to attach depends on the surface area. After attaching the first side, you proceed to attach the next one. Blocks are not attached all at once—just like detaching.

The attaching tool could also have two modes:


  1. Attaching one block face at a time
  2. Attaching multiple blocks within a certain range (an “area welder”), especially useful for block tools and large-scale automated assemby lines.

Ultimately, this approach only really works depending on where the attaching progress is stored. It can function this way only if progress is saved per block; otherwise, it would be similar as SE1's merge block, where after you attach the first surface everything else is merged back togather.

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