The Hand Drill - Tunnel Bore Mode

Ian Tyson shared this feedback 21 days ago
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This is a proposal for a Hand Drill feature that I think would redefine early game experience:

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Model as seen in Pioneer Edition Art Book

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"TBM" - Tunnel Bore Mode

This is a proposed function on the hand drill that replaces the current iteration of Right-Click and replaces it with a more useful system for hand mining in early game.


What is this mode?

When a player right clicks with the hand drill, the 4 beam nodes on the drill will fold out and the entire drill would begin to spin (creating a circle). See very rough Mock-Up image below.

This has a small range - say 5-10m in front of the player.

This mode would make drilling into Voxels much more efficient as you no longer need to be touching them. Like before, this mode only removes Voxels. No resource collection.


Higher level drills can expand the Circle size or the range.


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Why consider this?

There is and always has been a tedium to mine clean and straight-forward tunnels to the ore we want below ground. We currently have to essentially "hug" the ground to get anywhere - and often times the path created isn't easily traversable.

This would help in mitigating the frustration of getting to Ore by having the tool literally Bore Tunnels for you! Then players can feel that they can potentially divert more time into making that mine look nice + lit up!


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I do actually love early survival gameplay of SE - but the tedium of actually getting to the ore has always been a major issue for me.

The feeling of building a mining ship after mining in the tunnels makes the engineering/ creation element so much more satisfying as well! The early gameplay should be fun throughout the entire experience, and I think this may help contribute to that.


I think overall, SE2 will thrive if the slower elements of the game are looked at more - some being:

-Overall On-foot / Rover gameplay + polishing what makes them different and unique.

-Movement Adjustments (I think the player speed should be set to the slow walking speed by default!)

-Flight Speed Adjustments in Atmosphere ~ See my speed limiters forum post


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Inspiration:

Tunnel Boring Machine (TBM), or "mole" Machine. Made for tunneling underground.

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Additional Notes:

This feature would be for the Hand Drill. The Grid-Based Drill would remain as is.

However, potential beam drills for ships now open up (Imagine a rover with a Drilling Beam Turret!)


I am working on this proposal separately and I would like to refine my idea before sharing officially!

But to discuss the key feature:


-Small voxel deformation radius + Limited resource returns.

-How it works: Uses a gravity component to draw the ore to the central collector.

-Visual Reference: See Star Citizen Mining!


A reminder too that regardless of this Beam Drill Idea - the traditional Drill remains the most efficient for resource gathering. The Beam Drill stands apart for the ability to Mine at Range (useful in Asteroid clusters)

Replies (6)

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Update on this: I had the thought that it may be better to have it so the beams actually project a "Voxel Hands" style hologram so players can visually see what Right-Click will actually remove:


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Its almost like a projection that comes out from the laser nodes I pointed out above. This feature could also allow the drill to swap "voxel hands" so it can drill out different shapes like a square tunnel.


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I think the tunnel boring tool is still VERY useful and I have a concept brewing that is a new tool called "Terrain Manipulator".


It is exactly what it sounds like and can be used to restore voxels to it's original, "paint" paths, and obviously dig and place voxels. It uses canisters as "ammo" - these are filled when removing voxels. Players can also buy pre-filled Terrain canisters from stores.

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Back to the hand drill:


Drilling via left click: the ore is added to you inventory automatically as it does now in VS2.2

Drilling via right click (hologram): the ore falls to the ground and can be collected by hand - not automatically placed in inventory


I think this system may be a way to incentivize more player mining by not punishing the usage of the Right Click feature. Using right click is simply a different approach to mining.

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I think there could be many more ways to manipulate voxels in survival, going beyond just digging tunnels.

I’ve always liked how the game uses more “modern” tools like drills instead of futuristic lasers to excavate voxels. It feels immersive and fits well with automation. But it has always been quite difficult to do intentional terraforming. Drills are basically just spherical voxel tools.

There could be other tools too—like a shovel—that allow you to create flatter surfaces. And once you dig too much, there’s currently no real way to fix it.

We should really be able to place voxels in survival as well: fill holes, smooth terrain, build flat landing pads, ramps, walls, bunkers, even add grass to create parks and more natural environments.

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Great feedback, thank you @4Peace!


You know, as I've thought more on drilling in SE, I do agree with you. There is a charm and game-identity where players use traditional Drills in Space Engineers. That is a core part of SE experience - so we shouldn't lose that.


I think truly my view is that hand drilling is just a bit "clunky" at the moment. I think some adjustments around hand mining and how to make it more enjoyable will go farther than completely adding a laser element. For starts, I do think increasing range (so players aren't smashing their face into rock) would be good!

While I do see use for laser extraction on ships and rovers - I think the player experience should continue to be more grounded!


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How do you feel about the Terrain Manipulator tool idea I added here in the comments? It would essentially act as voxel hands in Creative Mode - as well as eventually having features like flattening, ramps, path painting, etc.


Almost like a drill 2.0 (but it doesn't collect the ore for you). If you hit an ore pocket, I think the ore should simply fall to the ground. Would love your feedback on this idea, you're always well spoken and I do appreciate any constructive criticism from you!

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Paint tools feel more like something that belongs in Creative mode. In Survival, you would need to actually add voxel material on top instead of just “painting” terrain into existence.

Also, there is an important technical aspect here: you want to avoid giving players an easy way to massively alter voxels in Survival. On servers, that can quickly explode save file sizes and hurt performance.

As I said before, I would absolutely love proper voxel manipulation in Survival, but it should stay immersive, just like drills are. Things like excavator heads of different sizes, shovels, flattening and smoothing blocks — tools that require you to actually engineer interesting grids and mechanisms in order to efficiently shape terrain the way you want. That should become a real engineering challenge.

For example, once you scoop a bunch of soil with an excavator “shovel,” you should have to place it somewhere else (or store) instead of it simply disappearing into nothingness. That challenge alone naturally limits excessive terrain destruction and creates more gameplay depth.

You would need actual storage capacity in order to collect or move voxels. Honestly, drills should probably stop mining if you have no space left for the extracted material.

Voxels disappearing into nothingness is bad for both gameplay and performance. Gameplay becomes dull and trivial, while performance can degrade quickly if players are able to excavate huge amounts of terrain too easily.

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I agree that mined voxel material shouldn’t “disappear,” but should be stored somewhere (even if in a “compressed” form). This should also apply to the “rock” when mining “ore.”


It would be interesting if there were a block that could convert mined “rock” back into voxel material.

Idea: I have a work machine with drills that is used for road construction or leveling terrain. So that I don’t have to haul the excavated voxel material—which such a machine produces in large quantities—somewhere else, the machine has an arm with a block that converts the excavated material back into voxel material and deposits it on the surface of the voxel terrain, but now in the form of an embankment along the road being built.

At the same time, the blocks producing voxel material could be used to fill in depressions in the terrain. The combination of a drill, a block that creates voxel material, and a storage block placed between them would thus allow for the creation of a straight path on uneven terrain.

Essentially, this would be the block/mechanical equivalent of the "voxel hand" tool, supplemented with "material accounting."


One comment on terrain modifications: In SE1, all disruptions to the original voxel material (terain) were clearly visible when viewed from a greater distance. The added "new" voxel material did not render correctly; it was only visible at close range, so "camouflaged" objects could still be spotted from a distance. It would be advisable to fix this bug... However, I haven’t yet tested whether this bug also occurs in SE2.


Translated with DeepL.com (free version)

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I believe that “laser mining” and the subsequent automatic remote “suctioning” of the mined material is not the best solution. While this is obviously very convenient for the player, it also makes no physical sense.

While “suctioning” material in the immediate vicinity of the player during mining with a hand drill can still be "justified" by simplifying animations and streamlining repetitive actions, such an explanation no longer applies to mining at a greater distance.


At the same time, however, we must keep in mind the limitations of the game engine. Breaking voxel material into "rock fragments" puts a strain on the system because "rock fragments" are "free-floating objects" and, as such, have their own collision models and respond to gravity. The problem is that mining voxel material can generate huge numbers of such "free-floating" objects.

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Ian Tyson -

Visual Reference: See Star Citizen Mining ... ok, for example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=blx3Z8n9Etk

First thing—yes, HUD it’s very well done. The HUD infographics match my idea of well-designed, information-rich, yet clear infographics for ship control.


Second thing—it seems this game uses 3D objects, not voxels. That’s a pretty fundamental difference, with a significantly different way for the player to interact with the environment. And very different computational processing of the gameplay.


Third thing—I don’t like the “remote material extractor” It’s physically nonsensical.

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Rather than a Terrain Manipulator tool (like the one in No Man's Sky, for example), I would appreciate the ability to mark out (design) tunnels and chambers that would then be created—either "manually" or "mechanically"—by excavation.

In other words, the ability to mark a boundary that defines the area in which the tool operates (destroying/mining voxels).

Perhaps it wouldn’t be necessary to limit the tools’ working area.

In its simplest form, it would suffice to at least have the option to mark a straight path, for example, using a guide beam that the player would see in front of them — for example, by manually setting two GPS markers that would be connected by a visible line, or four GPS markers that would create a constantly visible "area" serving as a guide for the player.

It would also be desirable for “drilling” tools, both manual and mechanical, to have the option to set a fixed “range,” meaning that voxel drilling would stop at a predefined boundary and, when the vehicle stops moving, would not continue to expand the drilled space. This is one of the biggest problems—when the speed changes, the drilling device’s range changes, and it is impossible to achieve a flat surface.

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Designing and building an Tunnel Boring Machine (TBM) isn't a problem (in SE1). The real challenge is keeping the TBM on course — and removing the excavated material.

This is what my first "drilling rig" in SE1 looked like — a working machine with a pistons and gyroscope-stabilized drill. It was capable of drilling a straight hole about 150 meters long. The machine was held in place against the tunnel walls by magnets while working. 80ca060851a43d4935de9c406114a523

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The latest version of the drilling rig was capable, in its "full configuration," of drilling a tunnel over 600 meters long from a single position in roughly an hour (insane—over 150 telescopic pistons in eight rows).

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Another drilling rig - with a swivel arm - SE1 large grid

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Unfortunately, SE1 has a very annoying, even stupid "feature": it often destroys large underground structures if players leave them unattended for even just a few days.

More skilled engineers were able to equip similar TBMs with automatic formwork systems and welding units, allowing their machineries to construct underground spaces from start to finish, complete with walls and interior equipment (most often storage facilities)

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In the top image from the previous post, you can also see the difference in the "roughness" of the upper and lower surfaces of the cavity. The upper surface was significantly smoother thanks to the "additional" drill bit.

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HAHA!


Turns out this was a concept already! Thought I'd attach this as it is an interesting concept still.

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