Small ship Rebalance

Sardec Xavier shared this feedback 2 years ago
Submitted

So I have a suggestion for the game, I know that Keen is not the biggest fan of the small ship grids. However, I love them as a thing, they may not be, but could be.


Lets address the elephant in the room... Small Ships stand no chance against large grids. Turret are pin point accurate, and ship battles can be summed up witha few things being address:

Q: Are the Ships of the same gridtype? (Small or large?)

A: No: Q: Does Large grid have turrets (Max range) A: Yes: Large wins/ No: small wins

A: Yes Q: Does one have turrets? A: Yes: The one with more turrets wins A: No: better pilot wins


I like the challenge of having pilots skills dictate fights, not just who can do the more numbers of damage on the other player. So I have a few Suggestions:


1] Make all turrets have a slower rotation ,therefore there tracking will lag slightly (only slighty) behind a skilled pilot, that way as a player drives head on, they still get shredded. However, if they weave around turrets lines, and combining different lines of sight will lead to small ships still getting shredded, not just it is a turrret so it wins.


2] Increase fixed weapon damage to be slightly higher than large ship counter parts (For instance, gatling fixed is a +0.25% damage or something)


3] Alter max range of turrets as follow

Fixed weapon: + 0.5% of the max distance of turret counter parts (for small ship + 0.25%)

Missile Turret: 1000m max

Gatling Turret: 750m max

interior Turret: 500m max

4] Add a few new weapons to diversify combat

Ex.

Railgun: You charge up a shot (using alot of energy power draw) whn the shot is charge, player relaases the shot to fire a projectile that moves the fastest in the game, one shot should decemate most small ships from a large ship, no turret counter part.

Flak Turret:This gun should have round that explode in proximity to the target, like a slow shot gatling turret. It should have a range of up 800m and fire as fast as small ship gatling. It still lags behind the target, however the proximity explosions should allow the turret to still hit slow moving targets.


I honestly love this game and you guys have done alot of good for it. However I think these changes would help alot, bu I would want these done after more stability has be brought to the game. Server connection has been made much worse as time has gone on and the complaints about those should be heard before any of these changes come. Thank you for yourr time Keen

-TakoPablo

Comments (7)

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6

Large turrets could generally track slower but that's the tip of the iceberg:


They should look into how Eve Online takes into account signature radius. Large turrets have problems tracking small ships.


Something similar could be calculated for each grid based on a simple bounding box. As (if) bits get shot off, the signature radius decreases making it even harder to hit.


It's up to the small grid pilot to keep tranversal velocity up or "say good day to Reggie Ray".


Additionally, missile/rocket damage could also be affected by target speed and explosion velocity.


Turret targeting must be addressed too - block priority needs customisation options (I'm aware of the Smart Turrets mod - but was always too laggy). I think that to be fully optimised, it should be dealt with in the core game - not a mod (or at least a decent api).


Edit: Spooling up a jump drive could incur an increasing sig radius penalty over the 10 second period, increasing sig radius at an exponential rate, making fleeing vessels vulnerable to a few last pot shots.

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1

Something like that would be excellent and is a great idea for the turrets accuracy.


My example was turrets being slowed down so they follow behind the target was just a swift simple solution. However, there are alot more rebalancing that would need to be done. Small ships 3 x 3 block is not as strong as one large ship of the same armor type, despite similiar armor types. It should maybe be slightly weaker, but not that much weaker.


However this Idea you have is really unique and should definately exist.

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3

Have a look at my proposal for weapons rebalance, it involves rebalacing turret tracking as well as many other factors to provide a better balance between large ships, small ships and players as a whole. It includes a lot of elements you mention here and I like how its has overlap with mine. Please have a read and leave a comment :)


https://support.keenswh.com/spaceengineers/general/topic/suggestion-comprehensive-weapons-rebalance-lets-specialize-weapons-for-specific-targets

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Hand guns should not damage large turrets. Or damage very slightly.

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For such purposes, add manual launchers such as the “FGM-148 Javelin”

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I like the ideas.

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Absolutely agree. One other thing I'd point out is that currently Decoy Blocks on large ships or stations are not prioritized over small ships if the smallship is physically closer to the turret. This means that you can't reliably create a carrier or defensive ship that can eat gunfire while smaller fighters do real damage to their target.

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Last I knew, there was a bug that is seriously altering the effectiveness of small grid armor blocks. I call it "multiplied dmg carryover".

https://support.keenswh.com/spaceengineers/general/topic/small-grid-armor-blocks-are-broken

https://support.keenswh.com/spaceengineers/general/topic/weak-armor-block-destroy-nearby-blocks-too-often-when-shot


The bug makes small grid ships far more squishy than they would've been. You can do a comparison by building a small grid ship with and without the armor blocks (I used cryopods as armor on one build).