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Inertia dampeners do not account for attached grid mass in gravity

Chris Höppner shared this bug 21 months ago
Solved

How to reproduce:


* Be on a planet with gravity


* Build a heavy brick of anything, heavy armour will do.

* Build a ship with ample upward thrust and a landing gear on the bottom. Make sure there's plenty of thrust to lift both the brick and the ship.


* Lock ship to brick

* Lift off

* Stop all user input

* Observe ship start slowly sinking towards planet, despite having ample thrust to stay afloat.

Replies (10)

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Hello, Chris,

thanks for sharing this issue with us. However, when I did try it seems to be working for me. Tried with big grid heavy armor blocks and big grid ship. After I fly the ship and lift the brick stick to landing gear, the ship stays stable at 0 mps.

Can I please ask for video of this bug happening to you as well as the ships blueprint, so I have the exactly same environment as you do?

Also what type of thrusters are you using and in what altitude? It might be possible that if you are using only atmospheric thrusters in high altitude, they loose max possible power input as the air is rarefied there. Can I also ask if the thrust power is way to higher than the ship needs (also with connected brick), or whether it is just about the max values?

Please let me know. Thanks in advance for additional info as well for providing the requested files.

Kind Regards

Keen Software House: QA Department

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It took me a while to reproduce reliably in a pure vanilla world. I found that Atmospheric thrusters do not have this problem, and it seems to affect only Hydrogen thrusters.

I've made a world with a large brick and two ships. One has 187.2MN of H2 lift, lifts the brick fine, but can not keep from sinking. The atmo ship has 38.9MN of lift but will become stationary in mid air without a problem. Just make sure to enable gyro overrides to avoid swing due to the heavy "pendulum".


As for lift to weight ratios, that seems to be about 19:1 on the H2 ship and 3:1 on the Atmo ship. I'd say that is plenty of excess lift to achieve stable dampening.


EDIT: I just found out that I somehow managed to break one of the atmo thrusters, so the atmo ship actually only has 32.4MN of lift.

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Hello, Chris,

thanks for coming back so quickly and for providing the save.

It was my bad the first time - I used the ship with mix of all thrusters. So providing the save was indeed big help here!

Issue was successfully reproduced and put into our internal system.

Kind Regards

Keen Software House: QA Department

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I have a similar problem using a small grid ship with an advance rotor. I use this rotor to attach/detach different tools (welder, grinder/drill). basically it's a ship with modular tool attachment.

In my case, I used pure vanilla atmospherics thrusters (small grid large thrusters) until recently (I now use Azimuth thrusters and have the same problem).

Point is: when I attach a subgrid (a tool), the Inertial dampeners doesn't seem to "add" the weight of the attachment and slowly "sink" the ship toward the ground.

My fix for now: save and reload while the small ship is not docked (via landing gears or connector). It seems to force a recalculation of the ship total mass.

I hope this help fix all occurrence of this problem ;)

Alexandre

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There's a whole host of related issues. Ever tried to build a carrier? It's impossible to keep them from sinking in gravity, no matter how much thrust they have. If you dock a ship to another and turn thrusters and/or dampeners off one of them, they will both sink, even if the one that has dampeners on has more than enough thrust to keep them both in the air. I'm not sure if that's related to this issue, or if that's something else entirely.

I've found that lifting unpowered bricks can be stable, but if you're trying to lift something that has its own thrusters, it gets dicen without manual compensation.

I'm writing a positional dampening script to try and compensate for this on carriers, but it's kinda tricky.

Dampeners and subgrids in gravity are generally unreliable, and all the issues on this site are marked as "outdated" for some reason. They were certainly never fixed.

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Hi all. I too am having this issue. In my case they are small grid ships using only atmospheric thrusters. If I have anything connected via a hinge or rotor (havent tried connector/piston) the ship begins a steady sink.

In my case all the ships i have only sink at about 0.5-1m/s as im keeping the sub grid/s as light as i can due to this issue.

A fix would be a god send.

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Hello, Engineers!

I´m happy to announce you that this issue is already fixed and will be introduced to the game in upcoming major update.

Kind Regards

Keen Software House: QA Department

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Hello, Engineer!

The fix for this is in v200

Thank you.

Kind Regards,

Keen Software House: QA Department

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Hi,

Should I create a new thread? This issue doesn't seem fixed for me (as described above).

In short, a subgrid attached via connector or rotor on a small grid still sinks the ship when using inertia dampeners. If I use a merge block, this solves THIS problem, but some damage is caused on the small ship / subgrid if a connector is used (in combinaison with the merge block) or, if I disable the connector strength, the conexion is slightly more complex.

In any case, using a merge block is not what I would want since I can't keep the grids name (on the ship and the subgrids).

What can I do to help? New thread? Save file / blueprints? Video?

Kind regards.

Alex

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Yeah, it's not solved. Added to the problem, de-sync issues often show dampeners in opposite states for different players.

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