[Public Survival Test] Make "Basic" blocks not throw away

Geneticus0 shared this feedback 2 years ago
Submitted

Basic Refinery:


  1. Add module slots like the Assembler has.
  2. Remove some ores from being able to be refined in the larger refinery block. (Silicon, Stone,)
  3. Change the Ore >Ingot recipe so that Ores also refined in the smaller refinery produces lots of slag (gravel)
  • Result:
  • Ores removed from the larger refinery are only produced in the smaller one.
  • Ores in both get more material per Kg in a larger one.
  • Basic Refinery is no longer a throw away block.

Assemblers:

  1. Make a 2x2x4 Assembler (same as Lg refinery)
  2. Use the Current assembler 1x1x2 as the Basic Assembler
  3. Remove some items from the large Assembler (Non-Elite tools, weapons, etc. some low Volume components like Computers and put them in the Basic Assembler.)

  • Result: tier 1 tools are in SKIT, Tier 2 in Basic Assembler, tier 3 in Advanced.
  • Block size is balanced compared to refineries.
  • Small items are made in smaller assembler, larger ones in larger Assembler.
  • Basic assembler is not a throw away block.

Comments (6)

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The "slag(gravel)" would just clutter up the inventory and i prefer how the current the refinery works as it would be annoying to have to create another block along with your current refinery(also almost every survival ship would need a redesign), but i like your assembler idea as i always end up with ~4 assemblers per refinery, it would be nice to have an assembler that can keep up with production, it would also be easier to make room for such assembler without leaving empty spaces like the current assembler.

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Yes the gravel would, why it would be better to upgrade to the advanced refinery as the slag is reduced in the larger unit. More heat more complexity, higher efficiency. Looking at things from a melting point perspective, the rockier ore types are the ones that need higher heat to get the most usable material from a ore. Also not all materials need to produce slag/gravel.


Rather than looking at Ore as a progression path directly, this puts choice into production progression. For most things, even ore you may not have a use for, you take an efficiency hit post SKIT. That efficiency hit is in the form of speed and dealing with trash. Moving up in technology gives you the ability to process greater volumes of material faster and maximizes how much material per KG of ore you get.


The exclusivity of ores makes keeping the lower end blocks necessary, however it also keeps players from drilling massive stone patches when they have a full tech tree which kills performance. Once you have a large refinery you shouldn’t be mining stone for base materials any more. If you do it is in small amounts which can still funnel through smaller units.

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It's be cool to have the new blocks upgradeable with their own 1x1x1 modules but I'm on the fence about your balancing suggestions, as I've not yet had chance to check the balance out for myself.

To add to your suggestion, how about instead of having modules that upgrade the speed / power consumption, etc, of the new blocks, have the modules add new refining / assembly "recipes" to them.

That way you could start out with say, a basic assembler which can produce only certain components, then over time upgrade it to be able to produce all the components.

The upgrades would need to be quite expensive to keep progression paced but if it was done right, one upgrade could lead straight into the next one like a step in the tech tree.

It'd also mean the basic refinery & assembler would remain a useful thing to build later in the game, for example on smaller ships with less room aboard - or if resources to build new facilities were scarce on a new planet.

From a mechanical standpoint it could be thought of like bolting an extra machining head to the basic assembler - or a different type of processor to the basic refinery.


Just some thoughts.

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More Module usage would be great, but I do see the need to save something for "tier 3."

I've been using Arc Furnaces all the time since they were released - equipping one to a mining ship gives me an opportunity to compact my cargo down to nice ingots instead of bulky ore. They're fine as-is, I think, and the fact that they can process Silicon now is a godsend!

If we got more Modules to use, I'd really want them on Ion Thrusters...

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I believe the "slag" idea would be great paired with a use for slag like concrete blocks! I strongly agree that the basic blocks should be a part rather than a stepping stone to be discarded. I don't agree with the size changes of the assembler though.

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I'm not 100% sold on this idea as the larger block would require more resources and more power (logically speaking) so to jump from a survival kit to larger blocks is quite a jump. I'm interested to see the power requirements of the basic assembler drop to be inline with the basic refinery and perhaps have a 10 - 20% speed reduction from the standard assembler.

The main refinery is a large block to say it cant do certain ores, especially given an investment in speed/efficiency modules.

I like the idea of the tier 1,2 and 3 tools in the different assemblers/SKIT and would like to give that a try

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I'm reading through all the new ideas from this playtest and taking notes for mods to build after survival comes out :-)

I do like more explicit tiers, but I also agree that every survival ready ship would have to be tweaked to incorporate requiring a new block to refine everything -- so I'd vote against removing full refinery ability from the tier 3 refinery.

For an excellent tier system, take a look at how Supreme Commander 1 (and Forged Alliance) did it. There were always some things that you couldn't build if you only had tier 1 builders, and some things that were only in tier 2 tech, but their 3 capable builders could build all three tiers. Blocks stayed in their tiers, so you had to stay aware of where they were (e.g shield generators are tier 2 for cybrans, but you could upgrade them).

Anyways, I don't think of blocks as being throw away -- as long as their cost is balanced out and their percent of efficiency and rate of speed make you want to learn and upgrade to later tiers. Just my $.02 though. I'm super happy to hear all the feedback on this release.