Feedback about the Base game and DLC drama.(Steam Report)

Zsolt Roka shared this feedback 2 months ago
Submitted

Hello Keen!


First of all, i love the concept of the game, i truly believe it is unique and has the potential to become something truly amazing with proper managemant and care. I had fun playing with(1.4k+ hours) However, there are problems, which i would like to Address here, since I'm unsure about that the concerns of players on steam forums are being listened to, even you have a moderator there active and he supposed to report you back monthly(later i will elaborate). A lot of feedback going on there on the latest threads. Many are vulgar, but the message is clear.


This feedback is based upon my observations of the steam forums, i made a reading through the threads and also contains my personal opinion added in the end.

Sure, you heard that apart from a group of people, many don't like your current approach to the content added to the game as DLCs. These KSH customers split into several groups:

- No payed DLC, no further explanations apart of insults and cursing from many(not all).

- No payed DLC, those should be free and quality content as a free update to the base game and revenue should be generated only with selling the base game. With good content, more people getting into SE, like many other game does.


- Don't want to Pay for DLC, which lacks of meaningful content (gameplay expansion), but forked workshop creations and cosmetics only. Many pointed out, that certain content of DLCs are avaible for free on the workshop. Many customers think it's also unethical to ask money for it.

- Too much dlc, no further explanations or too much payed DLC on the store page will keep new players away from game.

- Willing to pay for DLC if the documented thousands of bugs are eliminated, especially the ones related to the main game engineering features. This group of KSH customers are not given details on the value of DLC content. Yet, they are not purchasing anything until main game issues are solved.(bug tracker list reference and poor single and multiplayer performance)


- Willing to pay for DLC, even more money if DLC content is quality, meaningful gameplay expansions on the base game, which are expanding the functionality of the game.


- Fed up with SE, having experiences with MW and ME.


Also there are peope, smaller groups according to my observations, who are:

- Welcomes the DLC, regardless of content.

- Welcomes the DLC, but wishes for more content.

These are my observations, which you easily can verify, just head to the SE steam forums and see it for yourself. You maybe find more cases, but i did my best with a quick readtrough of thousands of comments.


My personal opinion starts here, which also shared by with many other KSH paying customers according to the forum threads comments.

The game itself would be fun, good idea, but there are many issues:

- Game itself is in early access stage, suffering serious issues and a lot of bugs which are existing within the game for very long time. Base game lacks of meaningful features, gameplay elements. Unpolished, unfinished, unbalanced, yet pushed out of early access stage and payed dlcs are coming frequently to the top. I would like to here give you an example, how it looks like:

I am managing my own small business for living and serving my customers with my own work. That is my bread and butter.

However, i could find myself very quickly out of business if i ask my customers funding(early access) and in return my work is declared ready, but in reality unfinished and faulty, same time offering them to buy extras...

In this case i face reputation loss(valid concern for KSH, not just in gaming sector), legal actions against me, possibly refunds. Also for sure my customers would ask me to finish my job.

Then i answer: all right, i will do something about it, not promising a full work, but just parts of it(multiplayer), meanwhile in the same conversation advertising them a paid extra. This is just not a pretty picture and as a small business owner, morally i just cannot accept it at all. Because that is what we looking at. Sounds harsh, but true. Personally i want the game to be finished, polished, packed with good features, then and only then i willing to buy dlc(i bought the previous ones). I'm not even double clicking the SE icon on my desktop until that. I been waiting enough in my opinion.


The another thing i like to talk about is Public relations with your customers. Very bad idea to push out teasers, when your community is frustrated, angry, disappointed, raging. All of it because an unfinished product. Please try to listen to them, communicate with them directly on every forum where KSH is present at the moment. Yes, you will face some unpleasent questions and comments and not just your fans undiveded love for you no matter what. Answer their questions. Direct developer communication, contant is the best coarse of action.

Which leads me to the last thing i want to talk about. I am trying to be very careful here, but i have to bring the subject here. I just leave here a dropbox link with some screenshots.


https://www.dropbox.com/sh/8q4u9a6f53ffuqr/AADSzdSYUntg22zcuqHkuHEca?dl=0


I think i don't need to repeat myself, everything is written on the comments. I am questioning the the credibility of the work he is doing as a PR Staff, moderator. This is one of the very reason why i submit that report above and not just my own personal feedback. I'm not sure, if he does objectively what he supposed to. I am not questioning his help of players with other issues. I think he does that best as he can. However. Those posts are worrying me. His writing indicates, that he is not objective in his monthly reports. When i asked him about it, just replying with prefab messages and empty statements without proper communication. I am deeply disappointed. Does the community being really listend to, who prefers to voice their opinions on the steam forums?


Thank you for your attention, wish KSH to overcome this crisis and i wish that one day i will be happily play SE again and buying DLCs with a good feeling.


P.s. I am asking the KSH employee to comment under the feedback. Nothing special, just that you read it.

Thank you so much.


Edit: i attach an another screenshot as an example of the case. In my opinion, this is just unacceptable PR!!!

Comments (5)

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Just came on my mind:What is this Clang Cola and Clang safe zone texture? Clang should be eliminated, fixed, dismissed and burried it's existence deep in the past. Not advertising the own fault of your game with it as a cool thing. Making it a cool marketing title, like a completely normal and acceptable phenomenon, which belongs to the product. Am i the only one who thinks it is upside down?

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Your thoughts echo what an awful lot of veterans are saying - The DLC is unreasonable given how broken and empty the game is. Not to mention the damage the PR is doing.


I shall not touch upon the issue with that moderator other than he is most definitely not right for that role and has incredibly biased behaviour.

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So many bugs are fixed. THX Space Engineers Team, for keep updating . ^^

I love your DLC politics!! But I buy it later, sorry.

I think, the players think, the Game is bugy because the don't understand, why the machines don't work.


Mostly you are the problem, not the Game. XD

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If that is the case, please explain what I'm doing wrong to get this issue. https://support.keenswh.com/spaceengineers/pc/topic/disconnecting-connectors-commonly-breaks-h2-and-o2-distribution

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Game is buggy because they haven't sorted it. It's Keen, not the users.


Recent example - The 'Your graphics card has overheated or the driver has crashed.' Issue.

This started over 6 months ago, and yet Keen closed off the issue as 'Solved'.


They have commented on there since with people saying it's still an issue - yet they didn't re-open it.

They have also stated on there that they know the message is incorrect, yet 6 months on they haven't even changed that (it's literally a 5 minute job to alter that message).

So Keen are content to not only mark a major issue as solved despite knowing otherwise, but keep the message on there incorrectly telling the user their system is overheating.

That's either massive incompetence or deliberate ignorance.

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or both.

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Just a quick note on the overheat message issue, to my knowledge that message comes up if the graphics handle becomes invalidated and an operation returns DXGI_ERROR_DEVICE_REMOVED. However, only one of the six reason codes are due to a hardware fault; three are caused by application errors, and two can be served by Windows under certain circumstances. A lot of games won't even attempt to recover from this sort of situation, so I don't quite put the blame on Keen for this, but it is a problem they hardcoded the message to say it was a driver crash and don't even check the reason for it.

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Keen, you pushing ppl at the steam forums to come here and give a feedback. Here i am, yet, you couldn't even bother to have a prefab reply(hello Engineer, thanks for the....), let alone having an actual person to talk to? Really? It's been over three days? Is that how you value your paying customers?

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Space Enineers is unique and is alive. I expect such a complex game that there are buggs. I hope they have enough money to improve the game and bring it to near perfection. Anyone can nag. It's hard to say anything positive. Nothing is perfect and you are not the only one to criticize the game.

I know how difficult and time consuming it is to develop a simple game. It is even harder to improve an existing system.

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Greetings!


First, thank you for leaving us some feedback! We are always looking for ways to improve and your feedback can help us do that.


Hopefully, this can address as many of your questions as possible, succinctly.


  • We will continue to focus on the development of Space Engineers for both PC and Xbox.


  • Larger updates, like SOTF, will include only cosmetics as paid content. Functional blocks (like the hinge block) will remain part of the free update. Our choice to split content like this ensures that gameplay mechanics are never hidden behind a paywall.


  • As mentioned in Marek's blog, the DLC is a great way to show support for the continued development of Space Engineers.


  • Our most recent DLC “Sparks of the Future” is our most successful release to date! This kind of encouragement makes us feel like we are on the right track.


As we have done for the lifetime of Space Engineers, we will continue to develop and improve on Space Engineers.


Moderation Staff.


  • We are very fortunate to have volunteer staff who devote a large amount of time and energy to supporting and moderating the community. We are very grateful to all of our volunteers and thankful for everything they do.


  • Dan2D3d, amongst others, invests a massive amount of time and energy into answering player questions and addressing community comments. We are incredibly grateful to have him on the team.


Thank you for your feedback and happy engineering!

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@ Space engineers support - Thanks for your reply, but wouldn't you be better off replying to threads like the overheating GPU one? You know, the problem which is still going after nearly a year, where you admitted it's the wrong message given and you are contacting Nvidea?


Any update on that? Can you even change the message so that it's not making less computer savvy players think their computer is at fault? That's a 5 minute job, changing that text.


Your content puts many builds behind paywalls. It divides the workshop, and as developers you are not testing properly before releasing patches/updates.


Your most recent DLC is a car crash in terms of updates, but I presume you mean sales/money for Keen, as you care nothing about the user experience.


As for your comment about moderation staff, Dan is a corrupt, biased vindictive person who has banned many and also told many lies. And, accused people of lying when they have proof. He also doesn't follow forum rules. He enforces the 'opinion' rule only for people with criticism against the game or Keen.


It's a shame you don't even bother looking into it, but that's presumably because it's free help.


And by the way, you could at least pretend you care about your existing ME customers. The forum has spam posts from over 50 days ago, which shows you're not even giving any support right after full release.

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