Add true joystick support

Sea_Kerman shared this feedback 5 years ago
Under Consideration

For as long as I can remember, we have been wanting true joystick support with configurable, proportional axis settings. Not the stopgap xbox controller support without proportional control. Just let us use our joysticks fully for once, instead of having to do workarounds with AutoHotkey scripts and Pulse Width Modulation key presses.

Give us our joysticks!

Thanks,

-Sea_Kerman

Replies (34)

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Hi, we will check joystick support and how it works and let you know.

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So how does joystick support work? And why does it only currently support 4 axis control (not the 6 required for spaceflight), hardcoded to an xbox controller?

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Still missing feedback here. Whats the problem that makes it so complicated to implement this features. It's like a must have for every space sim out there...

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I've been nagging for this for years.. there is no way to redefine a joystick and the default xbox mappings dont work on 98% of other joysticks... (eg tilt stick right selects hotbar slots in some joysticks... rather absurd..)


Realistically if they wish to keep the xbox gampad support, then they should add an entirely seperate "custom" joystick input method that can be easily redefined to suit any joystick. I've sucessfully made utilities that can scan the input from a joystick using the windows joystick controls libraries, and i cant understand why keen hasnt..

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M&K is adequate but I'd love a full joystick support!

My wish list:

  • Support any number of joysticks.
  • In-game mapping on a per-cockpit basis (with a default mapping configurable with game options)
  • Any "analogue" property can be mapped to any joystick axis (thrusters and wheels but also rotors and pistons)
  • Any block action can be mapped to a any joystick button
  • Accessible from scripts so I can write my Inverse Kinematic and drive AT-AT style walker
  • Mappable game functions keys and p.o.v. support (for head tracker support like edtracker)

I know it's a lot of dev time to do it properly, and some people hate joysticks anyway, but that's my 2 cents.

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I agree with this. I made a mod that maps the joystick to gyros and the slider axis to thrusters. It's not configuable or as complex as micro_g zero's idea, (which I like) but it should work with most controllers and joysticks. Search the workshop for "Joystick Flight Controls". There are some issues due to limitations that I have not found a workaround for but some API changes could help. In particular I'm not sure how to stop the default joystick action from occurring and there is a dead spot in the middle of the throttle due to the game setting the deadzone on all axis.

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Yeah this is a good idea. Would kinda make the joysticks on the flight seats make sense.

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great stuff - is it possible for you to make the source code public so further development on this can be done ?

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i need a steam controller support. 6 axis controll, stick and trigger.

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This as been requested for 3 full years now...

https://forum.keenswh.com/threads/full-mapping-options-for-analogue-axis-and-controller-buttons.7375977/

Upvoted many times over the years.

To me this should be a basic feature of any games involving a controller.

Thanks

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Just got Elite:Dangerous. This taught me one thing: HOLY SHIT WE NEED JOYSTICK SUPPORT!

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I apologize for the all caps but this is important


MAKE SURE JOYSTICK SETTINGS HAVE ANALOG THROTTLE MAPPING FOR ALL DIRECTIONS NOT JUST FORWARD AND BACK BECAUSE MOST HOTAS HAVE THUMB STICKS !!! THUMB STICK SUPPORT FOR DIRECTIONAL THRUST WILL ELIMINATE 90% OF COLLISIONS DUE TO HAVING TOO MANY /MODDED THRUSTERS. IT WAS NEVER ACCEPTABLE TO HAVE THRUSTERS WITHOUT LIMITERS THAT WOULD SLAM YOU INTO A ROCK WITH A SHORT KEYPRESS ANALOG THROTTLE FIXES THIS

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Bumping for more attention, all "six degrees of freedom" space games should have joystick support, including Space Engineers! Even if you guys just add in basic support and we have to bind everything ourselves, that's perfectly fine for most people.

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Not having configurable joystick support for this game is literally it's only flaw. Every spacecraft that has been built on this planet since mercury had 3axis pitch control and 3 axis translation controls mapped to a pair of joysticks. Even the cockpit/contol seat blocks have twin sticks. You don't see them with mouse and keyboard, they have twin sticks.


Why is this so hard?

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Did you say, "literally its only flaw"??

I'm floored by that statement and I can't even articulate a response to it.

I'm considerably less surprised that this still hasn't been implemented. Decorative (DLC) blocks were more important to add to the game than joystick support, because obviously you need toilets, tables, and other aesthetic blocks before you could possibly need 6 axis flight controls on a game that's supposed to semi-accurately depict piloting.

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It's called Space Engineers... Not Space Station Designer...

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My opinion. Not having proper flight controls in a game where you build spacecraft is a the biggest flaw it has. DLC decorative blocks are fine and all, for some people it IS about designing cool looking stuff. I'm okay with that. But I wanna be able to swoop in, pop a couple of guided missiles loose, and Wotan Weave out of the AA while their shiny station explodes into scrap. Izzat too much ta ask?

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Not the only but one of the largest. Most if not all of my collisions during docking would be avoidable with Analog input suport for thrusters >_>

@no thanks. In all fairness we did need the toilets to deal with all of Keen's S&%t

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I usually paly whith a HOTAS (Warthog) and I think it would be cool to be able to assign multiple axes like in most of the games simulating flight : move forward/backward, up/down, left/right/ pitch, roll and yaw.

Since V193, when i select "joystick" in controller, it seems that the default controller is the Xbox manette and then the two Tools menu are present and the mouse doesn't work as intended (Left and right click not working)... Before, I could control my vessels by the X and Y axis to move in horizontal plan. Now, I can only use keyboard because I have to deactive analog controller in order to be able to use the mouse normally.

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Something I sometimes use is a little program called JoytoKey. Main stick is set to mouse emulation for pitch and yaw, roll and throttle slider maps to keyboard inputs. It is very configurable. Not perfect, but it does work, and it doesn't mess with mouse controls when you want to use it.

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Yes, true real joystick support with each device (we hardcore gamers use multiple devices, often in "hotas" setups) and let us set up functionality for each button and each analog axis. For a good example of proper joystick support you can examine the flight simulator "X-Plane". Given the nature of Space Engineers, it is a huge disappointment that after all these years you still have not fixed this, and as of now (vrs 1.193.1) you have not even got joysticks to work at all, even in your setup menu. As is, if I try to select any gaming device I have - (tested "Crosswinds" a simple rudder peddles , and a "hotas" "CH" setup) the mouse becomes unusable immediately just in setup, and also the mouse remains unusable everywhere else including the game, and it appears you can only use one device: FAIL!

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Suggest you spawn a separate input subsection for each device the user selects in game setup. Then you need to allow each button and axis on all user devices to map/hook into your control/input system. And for all inputs that would benefit from a quantity input (including all thrusters), modify your control system: don't just support a on/off input, support true variable values that copy the current reading of a particular analog input axis that in turn throttles a setting to that particular value. NOT just on/off! Also be careful of how you poll or read the input devices, or you will end up with a poor implementation like Kerbal Space Program, (it sort of works, but it is glitchy). If you properly implement this, it should be possible for a player to do most things without ever hunting for a button or having to release a controller to use the mouse while in real-time game mode. This will greatly aid immersion and make the game much less difficult to control. It will be much more "fun" to play. Keyboards suck!

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The fact that you make space machines... And fly them with ONLY full throttle and ONLY full rotation speeds is actually a bit comical.

Lack of joystick support or sensible proportional throttle is just comical.

Wheel mouse for throttle, would be a huge step in the right direction too.

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Was really hoping this has been implemented.

I have a custom made controller with 2 x 3 axis PTZ joysticks and a serperate throttle axis that works really well in Elite Dangerous since all axis can be defined within the game.

Could we please have joystick capabilities with user defined axis?

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That's a feature that is really missing, joystick support would hugely improve playability, instead of always being stuck tapping keys.

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18 months, I saw that the comment it now under consideration. I hope this is a good sign. I'm still waiting for that before I start playing again and maybe buy the DLC.

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I've bought ALL of the DLC just to support the company in the hopes that this will become a real thing. I really enjoy this game. I've got over 1500 hours in it and average about 25 hours a week playing. This is what I do for entertainment. Having good joystick support would make this an AWESOME game. Fighter craft would truly be able to fly like they should. Even if we just had joystick support for Pitch, Roll, and Yaw, I'd be happy. If we get true, six-axis, proportional control we could build ships as nimble as racing drones used in the DRL.

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Now imagine what you could do with that and a realistic physics mod.

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I have also been asking for this for years now. I have asked many many times during Keen and Xoc streams and never get a response.

SE is one of my all time favorite games. It is the ONLY game that has never been uninstalled since I first bought it on Steam.

But I am baffled as to why this has not been a feature since the earliest days of the game. I mean, there are literally joysticks in every cockpit/control seat in the game. A 2000s+ game where you literally design, build, and fly space ships that DOESN'T have joystick support just boggles the mind.

PLEASE, Keen. Add true analogue/joystick support. Not that 2-axis strafe nonsense that is in the game now.

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They still haven't added this? Incredible. This is why the support forums are still on my bookmarks, even though I haven't played the game in many months. Can't bottle this level of ineptitude, but if you could... KSH would be selling it.

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Add joystick support and I'll purchase your game on steam

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If it's to complicate or time consuming to do it yourself, simple add a option for %-based controls and give modders the chance to use more than 1 input device - I'm quit sure the result will be good than. But keeping it like this is simply sad and makes me a bit angry (even after buying each and every DLC that was published too support development)

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STILL Keen? Still? No joystick support... in a space sim where you build custom flyable machines... STILL?

I'm gonna check back in a couple years to see if they ever manage to figure this out, lol.

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Adding this to the client plugin ideas to work on: https://www.patreon.com/semods

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Every year or so I check here to see if true analog joystick support has been implemented. They need to make data input assignable to any axis on any plugged in device on a pc (or x-box, etc.. ?). Once this very very good feature is implemented I will buy this game on steam as well, and not before!

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I agree that for flight controls a joystick would be much better than mouse or especially keyboard.

May have some time to look into the related code. It will definitely need a client plugin to get right, but may be possible. It depends on how many places the code needs to be patched and whether it is technically possible at all. (Runtime patching has its own limitations.)

Unfortunately I sold my Hotas X52 Pro about ~3 years ago, after got disillusioned with the bad VR support in Elite Dangerous.

Would it be possible to test this feature properly with just an XBox controller connected to a PC? That one I still have.

Please feel free to join the SE Mods Discord server if you are interested in testing this feature, once complete. Invite

You can also monitor the progress there if I ever get into implementing this client plugin.

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It looks like Keen doesn't listen...

DLC's are nice... but a game with movements in any possible direction without fully configurable joystick and throttle controll in 2021?!

Modern games have 6dof device support... but hey, we have modders and scripting guys trying to fix game basics... the first 1000 h playtime was working without it so the next 1000 will also...

But it really would give the game a new dimension...

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Come on now... This request has been around for almost 5 years...

Do something :(


Originally posted by : mikeloeven on Dec 7, 2015...


https://forum.keenswh.com/threads/full-mapping-options-for-analogue-axis-and-controller-buttons.7375977/

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Client plugin developers already started to work on something along these lines:

https://github.com/wolfe-labs/SE-AnalogThrottlePlugin

https://github.com/wolfe-labs/SE-AnalogThrottlePlugin/tree/main/AnalogThrottleScriptingAPI

Already usable for those who can write scripts. But no configuration UI for the regular player yet.

Please consider contributing to the development, so real joystick support can become a reality. Thank you!

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Still waiting for this. It is the one feature that might actually get me to play the game again. I love and support Keen and all the DLC. But truth be told, I have barely played the game at all through the past 4-5 of them. I might jump in and check stuff out but beyond that I’m just not that interested. My favorite thing to do in space games is fly spaceships. But flying in SE just isn’t very fun for me anymore. I’ll take function over fancy any day. By all means keep making DLC but PLEASE don’t make that the focus. Eventually I won’t see any point in continuing to purchase DLCs I won’t ever use.

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There is a client plugin which wires controller (joystick) input to in-game PB script actions: https://github.com/wolfe-labs/SE-AnalogThrottlePlugin


You will need to install the Plugin Loader, then you can enable this plugin from the Plugins menu:

https://github.com/austinvaness/PluginLoader


It needs some setup to fly ships. There are some sample scripts which may help, please read all the instructions on the above links.


Please let us know if you're interested, so the plugin can be developed further and the setup can be made simpler.

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I ,along with pretty much everyone else commenting here, am aware of the third party solutions. None of them work very well. Which is kind of the point of this thread. To get keen to understand that for the type of game SE is to not have NATIVE joystick support is just silly.

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I guess that having third-part solutions also shows that it is possible add this features. Keen just seems uninterested in adding this feature into the game but instead just selling more DLCs. I will start playing again once this features is added (and likely also buy DLCs again than).

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@Viktor,


Thanks for the work doing this, I am very interested and will be trying it out soon. But what we really need is vanilla support for all those servers that don't allow PB scripts to run.

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Certainly if you use a console style gamepad some of the game controls work, and you can of course use the function wheel like on console too, but every gamepad i tried had controls mapped to nonsensical things, like one axis might be turn or accellerate but the other would be select item on hotbar, and unusable things like that.


But for the analogue axis that actually controlled movement, the analog worked, and gave good precsion on that axis.. so gives a taste of how great joystick controls could be if they actually worked properly. Makes me sad to switch from say a day on elite dangerous, with my two joysticks and multiple mapped controls back to Spaceengineers, and I have to fly a ship with a keyboard :(


I suppose another 3rd party work around might be a joystick to mouse converter, so you can exploit SE's analog mouse movement with a joystick, but none come to mind, someone might need to code one.

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@xPhoenixXx "Joy to Key" has exactly that functionality and I have used it before. It works pretty good but it is a bit tricky to set up. It will give you the two analog axis that the mouse does, which are pitch and yaw. You will need to do key assignments to roll.


https://joytokey.net/en/

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It does not really fix the issue, you can't map an analog axis or anything analog to a vertical trust. period.


And that is an issue if you're trying to replicate the flight characteristics of an helicopter.

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The thrust/turn overrides suggest it may be possible to mod in even analog vertical, although from memory full thrust override is still less than dampeners, and full gyro override is stronger than holding a key down or moving your mouse like a lunatic so i guess that still leaves us where we started :( Really I don't understand why they didn't add this in yet. Even me, a terrible programmer made a VB app a few years back to read the controls from a cheap analog wheel and pedals for my (at the time) young kids to goof around with. It isn't even that difficult.

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Lack of native joystick support is one of the primary reasons I lose interest quickly when I load this up once or twice a year

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I love Space Engineers! Being able to use a joystick would be a huge boost for the game. When trying to move big ship I seem to need to pick up and move my mouse multiple times to sufficiently move in one direction. That part does get tedious. With a joystick being about to just tilt or rotate it would be a huge help.

Have a wonderful day!

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At this point I’ve given up hope this will ever be added. The few times I got any kind of response it has been brushed off as not being important to them with responses like, “there’s a mod that adds joystick support”, or “there are 3rd party solutions”. Yeah, I’ve tried them. And as much as I appreciate the effort modders have put into it they simply don’t work well at all because the engine just doesn’t support it. They feel just as clunky as flying with KBM.

I haven’t played SE in over 2 years. I like the fact that they are doing DLC for SE but I don’t see myself coming back until the actual experience of flying a spaceship changes.

FWIW, as of two weeks ago SE has been uninstalled from my computer for the first time since I started playing many years ago.

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This will be a huge improvement for the game.

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I took a look and searched for a library that could be implemented and it looks like most if not all C# libraries for controller support are completely dead or dying (DirectDX, SlimDX) meaning Keen probably has to or is currently implementing it in C++ or using direct input natively in C#.

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Apparently, a lot of this has already been implemented as of now, and is just lacking a proper UI to configure ingame!

It's possible to assign/configure axis to functions in ControllerSchemes.sbc, it's tricky to do but i've managed to get full throttle + 6DOF controls to function decently.

All Keen really needs to do at this point is add a decent UI to manage all that instead of messing with XML configs.

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OMG, it only took 4 and a half years to get here, only for this to be lacking a proper UI.


I keep coming back here every year only to get dissapointed -_-

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I'm VERY curious to see what that looks like. Anything you feel like sharing would be GREATLY appreciated.

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In short, i'm using a Thrustmaster T.16000M Duo kit.

I've got it configured so that:

Left Stick X (Left/Right): Turn Left/Right

Left Stick Y (Up/Down): Pitch Up/Down

Left Stick Z (Twist): Roll Left/Right

Right Stick X: Strafe Left/Right

Right Stick Y: Forward/Reverse

I'm still figuring out what i want as far as button mapping, and what the button names are in the config.


But so far the flight stuff has been really amazing, it does full analog on everything, so it's possible to build a ship with way overpowered thrusters and gyros, and just never put the stick 100% in one direction to keep it under control.


I've found some earlier work by Klime, that helped a lot. ( https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1V41S1jfnet9yETGkvXP9Xd0QaPbtsXPW ) I've used that sbc as base for mine, edited it to my own liking and made my own T.A.R.G.E.T. profile.


Also, a bug i've noticed is that if there's any joystick input whatsoever while using the keyboard/mouse UI, it'll start flickering between the two, even if the controls sending inputs aren't mapped. I got caught by the throttle sliders needing to be in the center position to keep the menus usable, but once that was figured out everything else went pretty smoothly.

Also, just to mention, Thrustmaster's T.A.R.G.E.T software is used just to map the two joysticks as one input device with multiple axis, nothing more. No faking analog with pulsed keys or anything like that.

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Axis mapping is pretty easy. There's been a plugin for that for ages. The problem is button mapping.

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Yes please, and please include PC joysticks (I'm getting the impression that some people here are thinking only of sticks on PS5 controllers)

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I wouldn't worry, Rabiator. This suggestion is five years old, well older than all of the console ports.

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